Pushing genesis back to 0

Technical questions about the Ripple API, the protocol, etc.
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby epsilon » Thu Jul 03, 2014 4:04 pm

donch wrote:
Vinnie wrote:I really appreciate the amazing efforts that are going into the reconstruction of this data!


Hi Vinne, the following quote appears a few posts back.

AndrewSF wrote:I learned today that their is a dedicated engineer working on getting the ledger header issue fixed.


Is this correct?

I'd be surprised if they've ever had a bona fide engineer, dedicated or otherwise, on the payroll.
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby freequant » Sat Jul 05, 2014 12:06 am

epsilon wrote:
donch wrote:
AndrewSF wrote:I learned today that their is a dedicated engineer working on getting the ledger header issue fixed.


Is this correct?

I'd be surprised if they've ever had a bona fide engineer, dedicated or otherwise, on the payroll.


They were referring to donch and Sukrim slaving for free to restore the data ;)
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby epsilon » Sat Jul 05, 2014 5:16 pm

freequant wrote:
epsilon wrote:I'd be surprised if they've ever had a bona fide engineer, dedicated or otherwise, on the payroll.


They were referring to donch and Sukrim slaving for free to restore the data ;)

Haha yeah. They're the right people for the job, even if they're not official employees. And free is good :D
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby Sukrim » Sat Jul 05, 2014 9:56 pm

To be fair, initially I just thought that sooner or later we'd just get a dump of some kind containing all the transactions from 0-32569 and the only real work would be to restore node data... ;)

At least I learned a LOT about how Ripple works internally while dealing with this stuff. :geek:
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby Vinnie » Sun Jul 06, 2014 3:03 am

Sukrim wrote:At least I learned a LOT about how Ripple works internally while dealing with this stuff. :geek:


That's unnecessarily harsh. If anything, we've learned more about the contrast between the original implementation and personalities involved, and the current development team.
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby Sukrim » Sun Jul 06, 2014 6:45 am

I meant that actually positive, not accusing or anything, sorry if it came across like that. :]
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby donch » Sun Jul 06, 2014 9:43 am

Vinnie wrote:
Sukrim wrote:At least I learned a LOT about how Ripple works internally while dealing with this stuff. :geek:


That's unnecessarily harsh. If anything, we've learned more about the contrast between the original implementation and personalities involved, and the current development team.


I think you might have misread "Ripple" as "Ripple Labs" in your interpretation there :-)
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby Vinnie » Sun Jul 06, 2014 9:47 pm

donch wrote:I think you might have misread "Ripple" as "Ripple Labs" in your interpretation there :-)


I think you're right about that!
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby freequant » Mon Jul 07, 2014 2:06 pm

Vinnie wrote:
donch wrote:I think you might have misread "Ripple" as "Ripple Labs" in your interpretation there :-)


I think you're right about that!

So what did you want to say about the way Ripple Labs is working internally? ;)
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Re: Pushing genesis back to 0

Postby Sukrim » Mon Jul 07, 2014 3:15 pm

In case you guys are not aware of it, Vinnie joined Ripple Labs months after this mess with losing transactions has happened, if you look at github he has worked very hard on cleaning up rippled's source code ever since (and did an amazing job at that). :)

Also this thread is about actually DOING something, not bitching again about the data loss, Ripple Labs, Open Coin, Jed, the weather or your mom. At the moment though it seems that we might be able to reconstruct some hashes + parts of ledger headers, also some of the skiplists and then that's it. With the released data, we can check some early transactions that probably took place every time the ledger was reset (80 billions to OpenCoin, 9 to Jed, 9 to Chris, 2 to Arthur) however they do not belong to this current ledger and I honestly don't really see a way of resetting the ledger one final time, for example on the day that Ripple comes out of beta, since XRP have already been sold etc. Also while a clean state solution (starting at ledger 0 agin, with ledger 1 containing transactions to recreate ALL current AccountState entries) might be interesting, it would still be a disaster for looking at history and make the situation actually more opaque than currently. It would on the other hand ensure that all API calls actually are possible though (you cannot get the full transaction history of every account currently, with a ledger reset + reassembly you could) and might have other benefits.

Most (currerntly imho all) of the things we can still do are now in the hands of Ripple Labs (they know who had access to rippled before the source was opened and how to contact them to ask for data), from a "foreniscs" perspective I guess we're done here. It would be really great if someone of the 50+(?) people at RippleLabs would sacrifice an afternoon to check through this stuff, but then again I'm half a world away and they might have more urgent problems coming up all the time. Writing mails to wisepass, bitstamp and weexchange are the last things that are left (and maybe contacting people from the villages.cc community who also might have had access to rippled early on) outsiders can try and it is something I didn't really want to do since there is a higher chance that this gets taken seriously if RippleLabs establishes the contact.

Besides any rediscovered backups of nodes actually running longterm on the current ledger chain (what about database dumps from the nodes RippleLabs hosts on AWS for example?) or ECDSA being broken (so transaction signatures can be bruteforced) there seems to be no chance on successfully recovering this stuff in my opinion. :frown:
Last edited by Sukrim on Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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