[NEW GATEWAY][Serving: XAG,NXT,CAD, and BTC IOUs] RippleCan

Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XAG] RippleCan

Postby twarden » Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:28 am

pigeons wrote:
You don't want to do this. Everywhere else in the world, 1 XAG is one ounce of silver. The whole point of us recommending you use XAG instead of your original idea of XSG was to allow you to get liquidity from rippling through people who trust other XAG issuers, for example Ripple Singapore. Now now one can do that, because your XAG is only worth 0.032 what everyone else in the world considers 1 XAG. So they will need to make sure any trust with you has the "noripple" flag to make sure rippling doesn't happen. I reckon there will be some upset customers who either overpay for your asset thinking they are getting one XAG when they buy your XAG, not realizing its only 1 gram, or very upset customers who have their XAG's from other issuers replaced with your grams that are falsely and confusingly labeled XAG. Please don't do this. It makes no sense. Just make 1 XAG = 1 XAG.


I understand your point. I've changed the OP.

The withdrawal fees are now 5$ for Canadian residents, 10$ for USA residents, and 15$ for worldwide shipping. A minimum withdrawal of 5 XAG is required.

As mentioned, silver will begin to be built into this asset this Fall. The following is the asset building schedule:

September 5th - 2 Ounces
October 5th - 2 Ounces
November 5th - 2 Ounces
December 5th - 2 Ounces
January 5th - 2 Ounces
February 5th - 5 Ounces
March 5th - 5 Ounces
April 5th - 5 Ounces
May 5th - 5 Ounces
June 5th - 5 Ounces
July 5th - 5 Ounces
August 5th - 5 Ounces

Year Operation Total equals 45 XAG.

The next year of operations begins AFTER a vote from all holders of XAG.RippleSilver in August for the release of 2 two book building options: a scarce schedule, issuing an increasing number of XAG per months (i.e. September 2015 1 Ounce, October 2 Ounces, ... 78 total, plus the prior 45, for 123 ounces ) or a more moderate release.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XSG] Ripple Canada

Postby freequant » Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:30 am

twarden wrote:
freequant wrote:
twarden wrote:Deposits are not fully backed as per the .02 spread on each gram received

I don't understand what commission has to do with backing.
If I send you 100g of silver to purchase 100 XSG and end up receiving 98 XSG after a commission of 2 XSG was paid to you, how are these 100 XSG not fully backed given that you have my 100 grams of silver in vault?


This is because I am offering a service to use a credit card as a payment to get into the ripple network.

Say you sent me a valcambi bar of 100x1g tabs. I keep all 100 silver grams in the vault - yes. However, I then sell the IOUs I receive as commission. Doing so, 100% of deposits are in the market and not held by myself. I simply sell the 2 XSG for X CAD (2$ at the time of this writing) and withdraw my own IOU to CAD to Fiat which I then claim as my revenue. This strategy is used to increase ask orders for each deposit, as they occur, for the market to decide if they would like to purchase a small portion of YOUR contribution to the silver gateway fund besides waiting for another 62.2 XSG to be issued the next month.

I hope that this clears things up a little?

That explains how you are deriving revenue but not why you consider that doing so would reduce the backing of some of the IOUs. If you issue 98 XSG to me for 100g of silver and keep 2 XSG, both your 2 XSG and my 98 XSG are fully backed so long as you keep the silver in vault and make it available for redemption. Whether you sell the 2 XSG or not shouldn't change anything to the backing.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XSG] Ripple Canada

Postby twarden » Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:43 am

freequant wrote:
twarden wrote:Deposits are not fully backed as per the .02 spread on each gram received

I don't understand what commission has to do with backing.
If I send you 100g of silver to purchase 100 XSG and end up receiving 98 XSG after a commission of 2 XSG was paid to you, how are these 100 XSG not fully backed given that you have my 100 grams of silver in vault?


XSG does not exist anymore. I've reissued it as XAG as suggested earlier. And I am a bit durr when I try to over think something simple in a complex environment like ripple is.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XAG] RippleCan

Postby pigeons » Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:59 pm

twarden wrote:
pigeons wrote:
You don't want to do this. Everywhere else in the world, 1 XAG is one ounce of silver. The whole point of us recommending you use XAG instead of your original idea of XSG was to allow you to get liquidity from rippling through people who trust other XAG issuers, for example Ripple Singapore. Now now one can do that, because your XAG is only worth 0.032 what everyone else in the world considers 1 XAG. So they will need to make sure any trust with you has the "noripple" flag to make sure rippling doesn't happen. I reckon there will be some upset customers who either overpay for your asset thinking they are getting one XAG when they buy your XAG, not realizing its only 1 gram, or very upset customers who have their XAG's from other issuers replaced with your grams that are falsely and confusingly labeled XAG. Please don't do this. It makes no sense. Just make 1 XAG = 1 XAG.


I understand your point. I've changed the OP.


No you didn't it still reads

twarden wrote:For each ounce received, you receive 31.1 XAG.


You want it to say: For each ounce received, you receive 1 XAG.

Or for your fees, For each ounce received, you receive 0.98 XAG or whatever your fees are.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XSG] Ripple Canada

Postby tmakarios » Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:45 pm

twarden wrote:All silver deposits are kept in a secure location within Canada, with security, and in a safe for storage. I am the sole key holder of this safe. I am the only employee of this gateway and exchange.

What happens if you become incapacitated for some reason?

twarden wrote:The next year of operations begins AFTER a vote from all holders of XAG.RippleSilver in August for the release of 2 two book building options: a scarce schedule, issuing an increasing number of XAG per months (i.e. September 2015 1 Ounce, October 2 Ounces, ... 78 total, plus the prior 45, for 123 ounces ) or a more moderate release.

What benefit do you see in having holders vote on your stockpile of silver? If people can send you an ounce of silver in exchange for 0.98 XAG (or whatever), they can increase your stockpile when it's in sufficient demand that your XAG are worth more than physical silver; if people can redeem five ounces or more of silver by sending you the appropriate number of XAG, then they can decrease your stockpile when there's so much supply that physical silver is worth more than your XAG. In other words, people can already influence your stockpile by putting their money where their mouth is, rather than voting.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XAG] RippleCan

Postby twarden » Wed Jul 09, 2014 11:24 pm

pigeons wrote:
twarden wrote:
pigeons wrote:
You don't want to do this. Everywhere else in the world, 1 XAG is one ounce of silver. The whole point of us recommending you use XAG instead of your original idea of XSG was to allow you to get liquidity from rippling through people who trust other XAG issuers, for example Ripple Singapore. Now now one can do that, because your XAG is only worth 0.032 what everyone else in the world considers 1 XAG. So they will need to make sure any trust with you has the "noripple" flag to make sure rippling doesn't happen. I reckon there will be some upset customers who either overpay for your asset thinking they are getting one XAG when they buy your XAG, not realizing its only 1 gram, or very upset customers who have their XAG's from other issuers replaced with your grams that are falsely and confusingly labeled XAG. Please don't do this. It makes no sense. Just make 1 XAG = 1 XAG.


I understand your point. I've changed the OP.


No you didn't it still reads

twarden wrote:For each ounce received, you receive 31.1 XAG.


You want it to say: For each ounce received, you receive 1 XAG.

Or for your fees, For each ounce received, you receive 0.98 XAG or whatever your fees are.


My mistake. I have missed another thing. You receive 31.08 XAG per ozt. This reflects a 0.02 fee.

By the way, does this fee seem reasonable? It is not much of a spread.

tmakarios wrote:
twarden wrote:All silver deposits are kept in a secure location within Canada, with security, and in a safe for storage. I am the sole key holder of this safe. I am the only employee of this gateway and exchange.


What happens if you become incapacitated for some reason?


I will leave instructions for a friend who I trust who will work as my proxy. I plan to ride the bus, not get hit by it :P
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XAG] RippleCan

Postby pigeons » Wed Jul 09, 2014 11:34 pm

twarden wrote:My mistake. I have missed another thing. You receive 31.08 XAG per ozt. This reflects a 0.02 fee.


I'm not yelling to be rude. I'm trying to get your attention because this is like the third time. And for current purposes we are assuming no fee, we can worry about the fee once you understand what I'm saying:

NO! YOU WANT IT TO SAY "YOU RECEIVE 1 XAG PER ozt. THIS REFLECTS A % FEE"

This is because 1 XAG = 1 ozt. Why are you trying to make it a gram when that's not what it means? STOP!! XAG = 1 troy ounce.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XAG] RippleCan

Postby dchapes » Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:03 am

pigeons wrote:This is because 1 XAG = 1 ozt.

I have to fully agree.

XAG is not a random three letters. XAG is a defined ISO 4217 currency code and it is defined as one troy ounce of silver.

If you're going to use XAG, then you absolutely should have 1.0 XAG/your-address === one troy ounce of silver.

If for some reason you insist on using some other unit, such as grams, then absolutely do not use XAG. There is no standard currency code for grams of silver so you'll have to make something up and be different and incompatible. However, doing so would not be a good idea (for all the reasons already mentioned). I'm a big fan of metric and I highly prefer measuring things in mass as grams or kilograms rather than measuring weigh in imperial units, but for currency codes that ship has sailed and the ISO code is what it is.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XAG] RippleCan

Postby Sukrim » Thu Jul 10, 2014 10:17 am

Maybe you are a bit confused by the "g" in "XAG"?!

It does NOT stand for "gram" - "Ag" is simply the short version for "argentum", the latin word for silver, also the symbol for silver in the periodic table of elements. "Au" (aurum - gold) for example is also in there. Even though I personally am also not too big of a fan of ounces and stuff, XAG is an ISO defined currency code and using it for something that represents only ~1/30th of the same thing with the same code can lead to confusion - it's like someone issuing "CAD" (or having a webshop with prices in "CAD") but then claiming it means "Canadian dimes", not dollars.
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Re: [NEW GATEWAY][XAG] RippleCan

Postby RafOlP » Thu Jul 10, 2014 12:25 pm

Yes, 1 XAG = 1 ounce.
I must join to the crowd here! :)
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